[Jaime]

This is being done in order to clamp down on anti-social behaviour and because people are intimidated by those wearing chav clothing (hoodies & baseball caps).

What do people think of this?

http://news.bbc.co.u...ent/4534903.stm

Quote

Mall bans shoppers' hooded tops

Bluewater has set out standards of expected behaviour

Hooded tops, baseball caps and swearing have been outlawed at Bluewater shopping centre in Kent as part of a crackdown on anti-social behaviour.

The retail and leisure complex is bringing in a zero-tolerance approach to intimidating conduct.

The move has been backed by Kent Police which has a dedicated on-site team.

Bluewater property manager Helen Smith said the decision was taken because there had been "issues" in the centre "at certain times of the week".

Managers have drawn up a code of conduct for the centre and people contravening it will be asked to leave the complex.

The rules outline the standard of behaviour expected, including not smoking, leafleting, or canvassing on site.

Guidelines say intimidating behaviour by groups or individuals, anti-social behaviour including swearing, and wearing clothing which deliberately obscures the face such as hooded tops and baseball caps, will not be allowed.

Ms Smith said: "We're very concerned that some of our guests don't feel at all comfortable in what really is a family environment.

"That's feedback from retailers, our own staff and from our on site police force."

This post has been edited by Jaime: 11 May 2005 - 09:36 PM

[Ash]

I think that it's ridiculous to assume that everyone who wears a hoodie or cap is a thug. And to ban people for the way they dress is a bit extreme.

[Rikki]

I don't think it's the attire that's the problem. They should just ban groups of youths, or just ask any group of youths they don't like the look of to leave. Working at a shop that suffers from abuse from youths with very little life, I wish the same rules could be applied to the high street, but unfortunately that's a public area.

You don't know how much I despise gangs of youths that make peoples lives a misery.

Ash, on May 11 2005, 10:32 PM, said:

I think that it's ridiculous to assume that everyone who wears a hoodie or cap is a thug. And to ban people for the way they dress is a bit extreme.

It is extreme, yeah, but the fact is probably 99% of troublemakers fall into that stereotypical dress. Everyone else who wears that style is just unlucky they share the same dress sense as yobs.

[Phil Mossop]

I know this would never be allowed, but I work in a shop and it is obvious when you see someone who you know is likely is misbehave or steal items. If shops had bouncers then these people would be turned away at the door, just like at bars and clubs especially. It is true that most of these people do wear hoodies and caps, with this new scheme there will always be a percentage of people turned away who would actually cause no problems at all, but overall I think it'll help their cause and will work out for the better. Some people wear their hoods and caps so far down their face is masked, personally I think this is intimidating so by banning this clothing they elininate the fear.

It certainly is very controversial though!

Edit: Rikki summed up what I was trying to say in a lot less words!

[CTerry]

Rikki, on May 11 2005, 10:44 PM, said:

I don't think it's the attire that's the problem. They should just ban groups of youths, or just ask any group of youths they don't like the look of to leave. Working at a shop that suffers from abuse from youths with very little life, I wish the same rules could be applied to the high street, but unfortunately that's a public area.

You don't know how much I despise gangs of youths that make peoples lives a misery.

We have the same problem. There's a group of youths that's banned from where I work for stealing. repeatedly, but they still hang around outside, shouting things at customers, and being a general pain in the arse. We can't do anything about it, because we can only ban them from the store, not from the street.

[Phil Mossop]

CTerry, on May 11 2005, 10:47 PM, said:

We have the same problem. There's a group of youths that's banned from where I work for stealing. repeatedly, but they still hang around outside, shouting things at customers, and being a general pain in the arse. We can't do anything about it, because we can only ban them from the store, not from the street.

We have a notice board at work with pictures of people banned from the city centre for whatever reason (majority of them steal) under a scheme run by the police, and they all wear this kind of dress.

[Rikki]

We have several gangs that come into the shop, shout obscene words at the top of their voice while other customers shop, and when confronted last week, they began throwing stock at the staff member who confronted them. In the winter they threw snowballs/iceballs through the door at customers. Last week they also paste-bombed the shop next to us.

They all wear the dress mentioned.

Stereotypical yeah, but that's life. Tough crap. Blame your peers. They're the ones that make peoples life hell.

[Sam]

I can fully understand intimidating behaviour and wearing clothing that obscures the face being warrant for this, but I assume that someone wearing a hoodie with the hood down, would not be "kicked out"? I've been meaning to invest in one!

[Rikki]

IAIHMB, on May 11 2005, 10:53 PM, said:

Even if, creating a "rule" based on a stereotype isn't smart. If I lived there, and they placed me in that stereotype, it would just add more fuel to the fire. Stereotypes are bad no matter how you look at them, I could say that the creator of this rule is a middle aged man with thinning hair and a little johnson that doesn't exactly rise to the occasion anymore.

Well this rule is designed more to stop them covering their face so that they can be tracked on CCTV and removed if necessary.

[donniesd]

Ash, on May 11 2005, 04:32 PM, said:

I think that it's ridiculous to assume that everyone who wears a hoodie or cap is a thug. And to ban people for the way they dress is a bit extreme.

Glad i live in the US.

[Phil Mossop]

Sam, on May 11 2005, 10:54 PM, said:

I can fully understand intimidating behaviour and wearing clothing that obscures the face being warrant for this, but I assume that someone wearing a hoodie with the hood down, would not be "kicked out"? I've been meaning to invest in one!

Yea, there must be more too it. I think it would be based more on common sense of the secuirty guy dealing with the person. Average Joe wearing jeans and a hoodie with his friend isn't going to pose much risk

[tomek__w]

What a load of ............

I've a good mind to take my son (14) while wearing said attire - just to see what happens.

It is unfortunate that many of the trouble makers do wear such clothing but to penalise the innocent because of a small minority is just stupid!

Yet again it just goes to show that the law is an ass!

TTFN

[CTerry]

donniesd, on May 11 2005, 10:56 PM, said:

Glad i live in the US.

Where instead you just get banned from churches for voting democrat.

[Stephen]

Its private property, they can enforce whatever dress code they want. Those of you saying "glad I live in America" may recall "during" Gulf war 2 we heard reports of people being banned from malls for simply wearing anti-war t-shirts, ah how quick you forget .

I agree with this scheme 100%, makes perfect sense, you wouldn't 'Barneys Girlfriend' and moan about being asked to take a mask or helmet off in a store so why should others be allowed to cover their faces?

Call me old fashioned but what ever happened to taking hats and hoods off inside anyway.

[Rikki]

ian_sargent, on May 11 2005, 10:58 PM, said:

What a load of ............

I've a good mind to take my son (14) while wearing said attire - just to see what happens.

It is unfortunate that many of the trouble makers do wear such clothing but to penalise the innocent because of a small minority is just stupid!

Yet again it just goes to show that the law is an ass!

TTFN

I think you've misunderstood the article (perhaps our off-topic replies aided that?). It's only banning them so that CCTV is worthwhile. It's the same reason motorcycle helmets are banned in most shops and no-one has a problem with that. It's the same as a club saying no trainers, no-one has a problem with that.

If troublemakers are able to hide their face with hats then they can't easily be dealt with. This makes it easier to spot the people that are actually causing trouble.

[fridgeuk]

Swearing I can understand, seeing as the last thing I want to hear in the shops is someone using the f-word every other second. Hoodies is a strange thing to ban, but then again it's understandable when you think about the CCTV issue.

Small thing that's a bit off topic, but Bluewater isn't the largest shopping centre in the UK. The MetroCentre in Gateshead became the largest in the Europe after the opening of the new Red Mall and public transport interchange last October.

http://www.metrocent...elopments.mhtml

[Rikki]

Where does that say 'youths that cause trouble'? It says hooded tops and hats. One would assume that if there's a 70 year old man causing trouble and he wears a hat, the rule would also apply to him.