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#21 realmaverickuk

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 02:12 PM

Rhett, the site might be unique. But if you look at Mobile9s members list, you'll see the problem exists regardless.

The larger member lists really are inaccessible. Brandon was able to make it a little faster, but it's still problematic.

If you're going to be honest with your customers, then there's no point debating an issue you know exists. I just wanted to make the OP aware of the issue he'll face, which he definitely will, unless something is done about it.

I did also say, that IPB has some brilliant features. It's just not perfect, but I know you guys are working on improving it all the time. If you can ever make the members table more optimised, that'd be brilliant for websites with larger member tables.

Quite importantly, we did require sign up for downloads, but we had to completely remove this and open it up to guests, because we didn't want our members table growing any larger. That isn't a decision a website should have to make. This in turn, greatly reduced activity, such as commenting and other member only functions.

When I view the massive VB websites, their member lists are instant, so I know it's possible.

#22 Pherson

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 02:12 PM

If a massive members table ever became an issue, could the same solution be used to separate the actives from the inactives as will appear in the upcoming version to split up the posts table? Would something like this work?

This way active users (who you could set to be those who have posted within the last 12 or 24 mths) would be kept in a separate table, whereas long-time inactives would be sent to the "freezer", a separate table to store dormant users.
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#23 realmaverickuk

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 02:22 PM

If a massive members table ever became an issue, could the same solution be used to separate the actives from the inactives as will appear in the upcoming version to split up the posts table? Would something like this work?


This is something I also suggested a long time ago. Or index members in to 36 tables A-Z and 0-9. If the username starts with A, it jumps to the members table starting with A and then finds the user inside there. I'm not a programmer, so I don't even know if either are technically impossible, but logically it seems sound.

With the members list, I'm not sure what the issue is, as theoretically it should simply take 20 users, then when next is clicked, it displays the next 20 in the table. But I don't believe that's what it does, it seems to do some kind of calculations based on the entire table each time next is clicked.

Look at Nexopia for example, it's a massive VB site and their member list works just fine.

#24 Dmacleo

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 02:32 PM

just an opinion here, but if IP engineers were looking at it trying to correct it there never should have been a rebuttal here to your info.
can members table be run on distinct sql server? not sure that would help, just curious.

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#25 Rhett

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 02:36 PM

just an opinion here, but if IP engineers were looking at it trying to correct it there never should have been a rebuttal here to your info.
can members table be run on distinct sql server? not sure that would help, just curious.


The developers are always looking to improve our products, this goes without question... however these comments are best suited for the feedback forum if you have suggestions, or the technical support forums if you need help.

"If you're spinning your wheels or sliding backwards... you better look for some traction, before you fall off the road!"

 

 

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#26 Dmacleo

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 02:45 PM

so someone buying the product would never want to know about using distinct sql server for certain items?

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#27 realmaverickuk

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 02:47 PM

Rhett, had this not been taken off topic, the original response I give, was on topic and something the OP should know.

Q: Is IPB scalable.

A: It struggles with large member tables.

I hope this is addressed in future releases and then the OP won't have to be concerned and can use the best forum software in the world :D

#28 Rhett

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 03:01 PM

so someone buying the product would never want to know about using distinct sql server for certain items?

Rhett, had this not been taken off topic, the original response I give, was on topic and something the OP should know.

Q: Is IPB scalable.

A: It struggles with large member tables.

I hope this is addressed in future releases and then the OP won't have to be concerned and can use the best forum software in the world :D


In both cases these effect less than 1-2% of all forums... again, I understand you wanting to help inform future customers, however these issues/questions are best left to the feedback forum so the developers can hear you! :)

"If you're spinning your wheels or sliding backwards... you better look for some traction, before you fall off the road!"

 

 

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#29 Dmacleo

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 03:07 PM

did not know potential customers had access to that forum, so those 1-2 % would not be able to find out.
but does not affect me so I'll bow out :)
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#30 realmaverickuk

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 03:13 PM

In both cases these effect less than 1-2% of all forums... again, I understand you wanting to help inform future customers, however these issues/questions are best left to the feedback forum so the developers can hear you!


The OP sounds like he falls in to the 1-2%, which is why it was important he knew.

I don't want to debate as you've always been helpful in helping resolve problems, but none of the devs bought this issue to light and I understand how important it is, to have a website that's scalable, so I wanted him to know. It's not fair to not make him aware of the potential issue.

I'll open a thread now, regarding the members table and perhaps in the future, it can be improved.

Thanks.
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#31 Lindy

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 09:24 PM

We have sites with millions and millions of posts, thousands and thousands of online users with minimal issue on the proper setup. The memberlist "issue" is acknowledged, but it's not unique to IPB. I've just looked at the big board list and all sites I've encountered using other, non-IPB software, have their member lists disabled.

I don't believe a slow loading memberlist warrants a broad "IPB isn't scalable" declaration. You're going to tax MySQL sorting through 2 million members without any additional provisions. I'm sure the developers will do their best to make this as efficient as possible, but ultimately, it's going to take a while. That's why most disable it - using ANY software.

Thank you for opening another topic for your feedback. I'm sure something can be done to improve memberlist efficiency.
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#32 realmaverickuk

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Posted 10 December 2011 - 10:04 PM

Hi Lindy. Thanks for your response.

You're right, In many ways IPB is scalable. I've worked with some big ipb boards with millions of posts and they run great.

Im glad the issue is acknowledged. Though even the biggest VB website member list is very fast.

But the member list isn't the be all and end all, it's more the members table and accessing it. As you say all those rows are going to get problematic. Some kind of archiving would sort it nicely.

Thanks again for your response.

Paul

#33 c u l8er

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Posted 11 December 2011 - 05:05 AM

OP asked how IPB worked with big boards and others answered so why should this discussion be moved to the members lounge and the feedback forum? So please stop getting all defensive. Also, not everyone's website revolves around a discussion forum. No need to insult.

"I don't believe a slow loading memberlist warrants a broad "IPB isn't scalable" declaration."
If a car runs out of gas after 50 miles does that mean it can go 100 miles?

"You're going to tax MySQL sorting through 2 million members without any additional provisions"
Tell that to the largest MySQL database in the world with over 800 million active members.


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#34 p4guru

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Posted 11 December 2011 - 06:01 AM

New to IPB just got my license and appreciated that discussions like these were in public non-licensed user only forums (private) forums.

As member lists aren't that dynamic in nature, why not make a static file cache of member list generated say every 60 mins ?

#35 Pherson

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Posted 11 December 2011 - 06:39 AM

On a side note, why does the memberlist even matter and why would you leave it accessible anyway? I only have 20k+ members in my db and I leave the function off (I'm currently using a different board but looking into migrating to IPB).

#36 Cyrem

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Posted 11 December 2011 - 07:24 AM

If a car runs out of gas after 50 miles does that mean it can go 100 miles?

Yes, it's called 'pushing'. You must be driving a mower to only get 50miles out of a tank.... so it should be pretty light to push in this case.

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Anyway, it all depends on what you need out of the software. If you are going to have a forum with a million members and expect millions of posts... you're probably going to run a fairly powerful server. With 3.3 having the archiving feature... you'll have less to worry about then now.
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#37 mat206

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Posted 11 December 2011 - 03:55 PM

How much have you done with table partitioning, given your problem seems largely a database issue?

http://dev.mysql.com...rtitioning.html

#38 TSP

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Posted 11 December 2011 - 04:46 PM

Check this out, it's exactly what you need:

http://community.inv...archive-system/

Yes... We know... That is what I was mentioning in my post. ;)

I am administrator TSP on the norwegian IPB 3.4.5-board Diskusjon.no.


#39 Alex

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Posted 11 December 2011 - 07:26 PM

"You're going to tax MySQL sorting through 2 million members without any additional provisions"
Tell that to the largest MySQL database in the world with over 800 million active members.


Let us conveniently forget the fact that Facebook has whole data centers dedicated to MySQL. Apples and oranges.
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#40 Christophe

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Posted 11 December 2011 - 07:42 PM

I thought the thread was about large forums using IPB :smile:
Here is a couple I can think about

http://forums.syfy.com/
http://www.neowin.net/forum/index.php
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