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RTL incompatibilities are getting really annoying

36 posts in this topic

Posted

OK, I know you guys are not RTL native speakers but is RTL that mysterious that you can't tell if a search box is rendered on top of the forum's tabs under IE7? of course, I can report any issues I have to the tracker including those which if you fix for this browser, you gonna end up messing it all up in that browser. I think it's just about time to come up with a more efficient solution. because:

1- You can't just rely on the browser to overwrite properties from, say, ipb_styles with ipb_rtl. It won't always work under IE7

2- It's simply inefficient. Because your including entries that will never be used. But rather got thrown away by the user's browser in favor of those in ipb_rtl.

3- ipb_rtl is sandwiched between to JS includes which would increase loading time and causes the user drop down menu to stay open until the page finish loading.

we need more efficient ways for handling RTL and to be honest with you no one of us has a real bilingual forum in order to care about how an RTL website would look when switched back to LTR.

thank you

Enkidu

Ajouz ♞ and iAdi like this

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Posted

Oh, how I wish the internet had a "Use RTL K THX" button. It doesn't, sadly so we have to rely on these CSS and JS tweaks.

.Ian and Ajouz ♞ like this

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Posted


Oh, how I wish the internet had a "Use RTL K THX" button. It doesn't, sadly so we have to rely on these CSS and JS tweaks.




I know but let me put it this way*. vBulletin has a nice right to left test feature. I just checked it under Chrome, FireFox, IE7, and IE8. and you know what? the layout was the same. It's not magic of course but, let's say, better support.

the same thing goes for phpBB.
---------------------------------

* yeah it's the vbulletin card >_<
Ajouz ♞ likes this

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Posted

All RTL issues being reported are being fixed, and relatively promptly. I'm not sure what more you would ask from us than to fix the issues that users find? There are bugs in the LTR skin too - it's how software development goes, I'm afraid.

As for HOW we attend to RTL, having a CSS file that overrides the primarily styles is EXACTLY the right way to handle it if you ask me. We can tailor the display to the RTL language, without having to maintain an entirely duplicated and secondary skin.

Ajouz ♞ and .Ian like this

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Posted

Seriously? You think vBulletin's RTL support is good? Have a read of this: http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/showthread.php?348241-gave-up-of-reporting-no-more-RTL-bug-reports-by-me-and-my-staff

(For those who can't read that, it's a 12 page topic in the vBulletin customer forums complaining about RTL support)

bfarber, Matt, Ajouz ♞ and 1 other like this

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Posted


All RTL issues being reported are being fixed, and relatively promptly. I'm not sure what more you would ask from us than to fix the issues that users find? There are bugs in the LTR skin too - it's how software development goes, I'm afraid.



As for HOW we attend to RTL, having a CSS file that overrides the primarily styles is EXACTLY the right way to handle it if you ask me. We can tailor the display to the RTL language, without having to maintain an entirely duplicated and secondary skin.




not sure what you mean by "having a CSS file that overrides the primarily styles is EXACTLY the right way to handle it" because I don't think so.

sometimes you have a div (or whatever) with:

left: 10px; in ipb_styles
and then you have for the same div
right: 10px; in ibp_rtl

and you see IE7&6 smearing the div from right to left.
Ajouz ♞ likes this

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Posted


Seriously? You think vBulletin's RTL support is good? Have a read of this: http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/showthread.php?348241-gave-up-of-reporting-no-more-RTL-bug-reports-by-me-and-my-staff



(For those who can't read that, it's a 12 page topic in the vBulletin customer forums complaining about RTL support)




so what exactly is your point here? You didn't think I'm advertising vB here, did you? I LOVE IPS. I really do. Otherwise, you wouldn't find me here. but the thing is: this is the IP.Board feedback forum. So, you tell me, does it have to be always positive feedback in the sort of: cheers you're the best...thank you guys...blah blah blah?
Ajouz ♞ likes this

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Posted

@Enkidu


All RTL issues being reported are being fixed, and relatively promptly. I'm not sure what more you would ask from us than to fix the issues that users find? There are bugs in the LTR skin too - it's how software development goes, I'm afraid.




I think that's a rather good point right there. You yourself said that you know they are not native to RTL, so they obviously rely on those who are to report the issues so that they can figure out a solution to the problem. There are even problems with LTR so it's not like it's anything biased against RTL layouts in any way. It could be worse though, there could be issues where it's TTB vs BBT (Top to Bottom/Bottom to Top), with LTR/RTL variances of each. THAT would be a nightmare. :)
Ajouz ♞ likes this

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Posted

We have an RTL skin category in the bug tracker. If you have any issues please submit them so they are taken can be fixed. Right now there are only 3 recently reported RTL bugs open. We are happy to fix things - just let us know.

Ajouz ♞ likes this

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Posted

thanks for all replies ,
I want here to suggest one thing .
if it possible to copy English language here and set this copy as right to left language so we can test RTL here and reports bugs immediately otherwise every RTL user need to create a demo site to test it in his demo , or test it in his live site .

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Posted


thanks for all replies ,


I want here to suggest one thing .


if it possible to copy English language here and set this copy as right to left language so we can test RTL here and reports bugs immediately otherwise every RTL user need to create a demo site to test it in his demo , or test it in his live site .



You mean have the regular English, but then have an "English (RTL)", so people can pick the one they want to use?

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Posted


You mean have the regular English, but then have an "English (RTL)", so people can pick the one they want to use?




Yes, but not because someone would "want" to use it (English is not meant to be read RTL so it doesn't flow well), he's meaning so that they can look for and test RTL bugs here on the company forums. i.e. if we release a beta, the RTL users can look for bugs here before the final release.

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Posted


Yes, but not because someone would "want" to use it (English is not meant to be read RTL so it doesn't flow well), he's meaning so that they can look for and test RTL bugs here on the company forums. i.e. if we release a beta, the RTL users can look for bugs here before the final release.


I figured that's what he meant, was just wanting to clarify it to be sure I understood correctly.

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Posted

yes , This is exactly what I mean .

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Posted


@Enkidu





I think that's a rather good point right there. You yourself said that you know they are not native to RTL, so they obviously rely on those who are to report the issues so that they can figure out a solution to the problem. There are even problems with LTR so it's not like it's anything biased against RTL layouts in any way. It could be worse though, there could be issues where it's TTB vs BBT (Top to Bottom/Bottom to Top), with LTR/RTL variances of each. THAT would be a nightmare. :)




You don't have to be a Rabbi to tell if the layout of a website written in Hebrew is broken or not. You see the type of "bugs" I'm talking about are BROWSER-SPECIFIC. For instance, you can simply compare between how the website renders under FF and under IE7.

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Posted


We have an RTL skin category in the bug tracker. If you have any issues please submit them so they are taken can be fixed. Right now there are only 3 recently reported RTL bugs open. We are happy to fix things - just let us know.




I know. I really know. What I'm asking here is to give more love to RTL. Sort of QA is you like. The whole point I'm trying to make here is: there many bugs in RTL under IE7 and it's getting really annoying doing all that. Whereas if you just set your English language pack to RTL and view the website in IE7, You gonna spot them yourself and it won't take you more than 5 minutes. Beside, you've already going to do that any way when I report the issue in order to confirm it.

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Posted


I figured that's what he meant, was just wanting to clarify it to be sure I understood correctly.




yeah I believe you. That was exactly your intention. :whistle:

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Posted


yeah I believe you. That was exactly your intention. :whistle:


Actually it was.

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Posted

We can add an RTL language, that's not a bad idea.

It sounds like most issues are to do with IE7 and IE6 - both browsers are now getting very old and there's a free update to IE8. I know that you can't force all your users to upgrade, but there's only so much we can do to ensure ancient browsers are able to view the latest technologies flawlessly.

I'd say that if IE7 can't decide what to do with a simple CSS override then it really needs to be beaten with a stick.

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Posted


We can add an RTL language, that's not a bad idea.



It sounds like most issues are to do with IE7 and IE6 - both browsers are now getting very old and there's a free update to IE8. I know that you can't force all your users to upgrade, but there's only so much we can do to ensure ancient browsers are able to view the latest technologies flawlessly.



I'd say that if IE7 can't decide what to do with a simple CSS override then it really needs to be beaten with a stick.




I can't force my users to do that. They would simply browse away to another forum which does support IE7.

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Posted


I know that you can't force all your users to upgrade,






I can't force my users to do that. They would simply browse away to another forum which does support IE7.


That's what he said.

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Posted

I stopped reading when the OP brought up IE6 & compatability...

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Posted





what's wrong with that?

Oh I get it. I need to put a nagging pop up message whoever is browsing my board through IE7/6 that this on-of-a-kind board is not compatible with his/her lame browser, so:

1- He/She can either spend the next 60 minutes downloading a cool browser (of my choice of coarse), importing all of his/her bookmarks, passwords,...etc and then get back to view the secrete information contained within this website and collect a bonus prize of $100 cash for anyone who would upgrade.

2- or ###### off.

yeah that would solve it
Wolfie likes this

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Posted


1- He/She can either spend the next 60 minutes downloading a cool browser (of my choice of coarse), importing all of his/her bookmarks, passwords,...etc and then get back to view the secrete information contained within this website and collect a bonus prize of $100 cash for anyone who would upgrade.



2- or ###### off.



yeah that would solve it


There ya go!

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Posted

We do not go out of our way to support IE6. If there is a serious flaw that prevents actually using the board (i.e. if you could not read any posts) then we would look into it. If a box is 10 pixels too tall, we're not going to do anything about that.

Virtually every big site on the internet (google, youtube, flickr, etc.) have already declared they will not be supporting IE6 moving forward. I'm afraid sometimes you just need to update and move on. I'd hardly think you could complain if a new video game comes out and doesn't support Windows 98. It's the same thing here.

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